36: The Brandon Smith Episode

On this episode of the Huge Transformations Podcast, host Sheila Smeltzer sits down with Brandon Smith, a retired Army First Sergeant turned first-time franchise owner of M1 Epoxy Floors in the Nashville area. Brandon shares what it really looks like to jump into entrepreneurship after 23 years in the military—trading structure and support systems for the chaos of wearing every hat in a small business. From sales and marketing to installation, bookkeeping, and hiring, Brandon gives a raw, honest look at his first 18 months in business and how his military mindset—especially adaptability and resilience—has helped him navigate the pressure.

 

Brandon and Sheila also break down the realities of running a high-ticket, non-recurring service business. They talk about the challenges of cash flow, managing large project costs, learning financial forecasting the hard way, and why closing sales is critical when every job is a one-time opportunity. Brandon shares key lessons on hiring for character over skill, building an install team, and leveraging systems like CRMs to stay organized. They also explore how joining the Huge Mastermind shifted his thinking—especially around understanding market size, opportunity, and simplifying growth. It’s a valuable episode for newer entrepreneurs and anyone trying to turn early momentum into a sustainable, scalable business.

Resources

• M1 Epoxy Floors

• Veteran Service Brands

• Housecall Pro

• QuickBooks

• The Huge Insider newsletter signup

• The Huge Insider podcast downloadable action guide

• The Huge Mastermind info page

• The Huge Convention

 

Transcript:

 Hello everyone. Welcome to the Huge Transformations podcast. I'm Sid Graef out of Montana. I'm Gabe Torres here in Nashville, Tennessee. And I'm Sheila Smeltzer From North Carolina, we are your hosts and guides through the landscape of growing a successful home service business. We do this by interviewing the best home service business builders in the industry, folks that have already built seven and eight figure businesses, and they want to help you succeed.

Yep. No fake gurus on this show, just real life owners that have been in the trenches and can help show you the way to grow profitably. We get insights and truths from successful business builders, and every episode is 100% experience, 0% theory. We are going to dig deep and reveal the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Our guests will share with you the pitfalls to avoid and the keys to winning. In short, our guests will show you how to transform your home service business into a masterpiece. Thanks for joining us on the wild. Journey of entrepreneurship. Let's dive in.

Hello? Hello, listeners. It's Sheila Smeltzer, a plus Pro Services and huge transformations podcast contributor. I am very excited today I introduce an interview. Brandon Smith with M1 Epoxy Floors, who is an 18 month new franchise owner, franchisee owner, uh, who shares a lot of his new entrepreneurial experiences with us.

We talk about the good, the difficult, what we would do different. We talk about how his. Retired army, uh, experience has landed into his leadership skills and, uh, entrepreneur entrepreneurial skills, how he's wearing so many hats. We cover everything from tactical work and the details about epoxy floors, fixed revenue to recurring revenue.

We talk about wearing all the hats. Um, this is just an awesome, authentic interview that I know that all of our listeners will gain something from. Um, I really enjoyed getting to know Brandon today, and I thank all of you for listening. Let's dive in. Hello everyone, this is Sheila Smeltzer with the Huge Transformations Podcast and I have Brandon Smith with Mach one Epoxy Floris here joining us today.

Hey Brandon, good morning. Thank you for having me. I love this. This is gonna be super fun. Uh, Brandon is retired army sergeant and he is a first year franchise e owner of Mock One Epoxy Floors based outta West Nashville. And we're gonna have a lot of fun today and really insightful conversation about the correlation between your background and how, you know, your serving in the Army has helped you with, you know, starting as an entrepreneur.

Um, I love that you're pretty new in the entrepreneurial journey, so this is gonna be great. Um, and I, you know, I wanna first start and just get to know you, but Brandon, introduce yourself. Uh, tell us a little bit about yourself and your family and a little bit about Mach One. Okay. Um, so yes, I am, uh, just under 18 months business owner.

Uh, I bought a franchise Wan Epoxy. Um, we do operate in the greater Nashville area, Nashville West based. Um, I've been, like I said, I've been doing that for about 18 months, but prior to that I spent 23 years in the Army. I retired as a senior enlisted advisor or a first and a, uh, first sergeant. Um, over a counter drug task force.

Um. In that is vastly different, but a lot of the same, going from that role, transitioning to a business owner, um, a little more chaos in the, in the small business world, trying to manage all of the hats instead of having the supporting framework. But, uh, we're figuring it out. Um, I'm a father. I have two children, 11 and eight, grace and Madeline, and, uh, they're my other side of chaos.

So there's no rest. And I understand, I understand you're handyman to your wife as well. Yes. If there is a project I am responsible for doing said project, um, probably not the best at getting them done any, any timely, but, uh. We, uh, we do a lot. We live out here, uh, just south of Clarksville and north of Dixon in almost no man's land.

A little county of Houston County that, uh, has about 8,000 people in total. So we got a couple of stoplights that we don't really need. Uhhuh, it's quiet out here, but there's lots of projects. That's great. Well, she's lucky to have you, Brandon. Thank you. Thank you. So, wearing all of these hats, um, how has your experience and, you know, just 23 years in the Army, how, how, what are these skill sets that have helped you navigate, um, your 18 months, starting out with the franchise?

Well. In the military, we said a lot of things like embrace the suck. Mm-hmm. So when things got chaotic and it just wasn't going well and there's lots of regulations, there's lots of guidance, um, but sometimes things just don't fit in that framework. And being able to think outside the box and being able to, um, mold to the situation you're in has helped me tremendously.

Um, coming over to the entrepreneurial side and opening Mock one Epoxy, um, was exciting and fun is still exciting and fun, but it does not come easy. There's still a lot of stress. There's still, I am the salesman. I am the owner, I am the installer. I am the maintenance guy. I, I do all of the things. I do the bookkeeping and the manage our accounting and the accounting.

So. That's a lot. It is a lot. Um, yep. Been there and trying to make sure that you do it right. And I can tell you that, uh, there's, there's nights that I wake up and I'm still stressed about the business and stressed that, uh, I'm making the right decisions for us. But, uh, overall turning in here in our second year now, um, things are really looking up and business is going really well.

My employees are doing great. They're installing floors like crazy. And, uh, we're booked up for a couple of months. And I, I, I gotta say that, uh, that's not without the score of the huge, it's not without the score of the community that, uh, I'm in at Mach one or Better Service brands, but, uh, we're doing really, really well.

I love to hear that. Um, such a success on, on the, you know, coming out of the gate, it sounds like, um, Brandon, tell, tell me about hiring. So how did you. You know, uh, I, I do not, I'm not part of a franchise. Um, but how does that work when you're starting out? You've got a brand new location, um, you're the franchisee.

How did you know who to hire first? How did you know, how did you start filling in the roles? Roles, and what does, what is the size of your organization after 18 months? So, when I opened, my intention was to go slow. Um, I wanted to understand the business I, from, from the base level all the way up. So I wanted to install floors on my own.

I wanted to manage all the risk within my two hands. Okay. Um, I did that for about three months. My goal was to do it for a year, and after about three months, I realized that it was impossible. There's no way that I could turn a true profit, um, manage the entire business and go out and do floors.

Tennessee is a great place and Nashville is fairly, fairly metropolitan, so there is a lot of work there. But I was traveling a couple of hours to job sites on a daily, so I'm losing those couple of hours that the business needed for me or that I needed to work on the business rather. Um, so about three months in, I decided that it was time to start looking for a laborer.

Um, we put out an add or two. Um, I took a couple of interviews, had a couple of coffees. I'm not a, coming from the military, I've done a lot of boards that are very regimented and I've always found that anybody can study in passive board. You can, you can be prepared and seem as if you know what you're doing.

I like to have a conversation. I like to talk to people and really get a feel for who they are, especially if I'm gonna work with them or trust them on a daily basis. Sure. So I tend to take people to coffee. I tend to invite potential employees out for. On the job, uh, training or on the job, uh, interviews.

Let them put their hands on tools, talk me through their processes, and, uh, help validate some of their experience. Excuse me. Help validate some of their experiences. And, um, that has done me very, very well since I've opened the business. So we are, we have two employees now. Okay. I was very fortunate. My lead installer has about 20 years of experience in industrial epoxy work.

Wow. Great pickup. I, it's been fantastic. Um, I've got, I gotta, I gotta keep paying him more 'cause he is definitely worth it. But, uh, a fantastic pickup and has relieved a lot of stress on the installs, allowing them to go out and do floors without me standing and holding hands. But, um, I have a second employee who's a second year guy who's had some training prior to coming to me, but, um.

Was a high culture guy. He's, he's young, works hard, is honest. Yep. Yep. Shows up every day, communicates really well. Um, and I can say that after having somebody that's got the knowledge and capability to do the job, that my second highest criteria is having that, that moral, moral compass. Right. The people that are gonna be honest with you, even if they don't have the capability, you can train somebody to do a job.

You can't necessarily instill your culture and your morals in somebody that just doesn't have them. Yeah. And so that's my, uh, my install team. We've gone through a couple of laborers, um, in the last year trying to find the right set of guys. Mm-hmm. And, uh, we're continuing to grow and looking for other laborers currently.

But, um, that's kinda the process that I go through. I'm, I try not to stick to any one solid method. I'm really just trying to evaluate people for who they are versus what they can do, because we can teach 'em to do floors. Okay, great. So, um, you've, you've got a good operations team started. Um, how, how are you doing sales and marketing?

Oh, not well. Um, so love your, we have spent a lot of money on marketing. Um, fortunately the franchise has a primary company that we use for marketing, and they are, they're good. We are just learning how to employ them appropriately. Um, and so some of the ideas or processes we've tried have cost us with little to no reward.

But, um, this year we've kind of upped, we're in doing meta marketing and we're also doing Google marketing. Both of those things, I think we're a little around, right around $2,400 a month is what we spend, and we're starting to see the appropriate return on investment there. But I am consistently told, and I need to do a better job of.

Digital marketing is not the only platform. You need to find multiple avenues, multiple streams to get your, your brand out there to get your business out there. So doing home shows and doing community events, um, social media, all of those things are things that we could definitely improve upon. And that's gotta come with me having the time available to do it.

Yeah, very good. And this is something that, uh, we learn from the huge mastermind, is that we really wanna be focused on marketing over five to seven different channels, seven to 10 times per year. That's just a really good framework and um, you're right, it is, it is a lot. And then it's also knowing your market.

And where are the people that are buying your epoxy floors and being in those places and in front of them. Um, so good for you. So you get a lead coming in. So it sounds like you have some lead gen coming in from your meta and your Google, and you still have some work to do there, but when the lead comes in, who's doing the sales?

Is that you? That's me. That's me. I'm first contact. So, uh, speed to lead is, is my mantra right now. Trying to, as soon as that lead comes in, um, I don't make calls after 10 o'clock at night, but anything before that, I will pick up the phone and call that customer right away. Very good. The conversations vary.

It really depends on the customer and, and where they're at in their buying process. Mm-hmm. If, uh, if at all possible, I try to schedule an in-person interview, um, I go and I look at their concrete and, and do a true estimate, give them a price on the, on there, and I walk them through their process and why we're a better fit for what they're looking for versus, um, say a truck on the truck that's just operating on Facebook and no insurance and no technical expertise or shoddy material.

Um, but yeah, I'm the guy that, uh, manage it from start to finish. I hand them off to our lead installer, Fred, for the installation, but all the way up until the date of installation, they're mine. And then after installation, they're mine again for about a week or two while I go through a follow up process, search for a Google Review and make sure that we've met all of their requests and requirements.

Great. And then before we move on to that administrative part, because now you have to collect the money and make sure that the money's in the bank and the cash flow and all of that, um. Uh, just take me into the world of epoxy flooring real fast. 'cause I've always been very curious. What, what solutions are you trying to solve for your clients that are in search of floor coatings?

What, what are they looking for? What, what are the problems that they're experiencing that, that the epoxy? Sure. So I'll, I'll give you a couple of scenarios, a couple quick scenarios. Um, I would say residential wise, our primary customer right now is new construction. Nashville's booming. People are building houses left and right.

Um, they're building chops and pole barns and stuff like that. Okay. And what they're looking for is they're trying to get out in front of stains. They're trying to get out in front of chipping or, uh, concrete dust in their spaces. And so what we're coming in and doing is we're applying a resonance floor for them that allows, it's easy to clean, it's chemical resistant, it's not gonna fade.

Um. And it lasts essentially forever. I, we, we give a lifetime adhesion warranty, but we give a 10 year workability warranty. So if, uh, if they should scratch it or, or damage it in any way, we come back and we fix those things. Okay. Now on the other side is the older, um, floors or customers that are looking for a resurfacing.

Somebody that's either had a floor previously, they've done final tile or carpet or something like that in their home, or their garage has just always been a, uh, a concrete garage and it's stained up with oil and all of that stuff. So what we come in is we re rejuvenate the concrete by grinding off that top coat and applying epoxy to it, um, and basically bring their floor back to smooth.

We repair any cracks or divots, um, and provide them a brand new surface to, to live and operate on. Okay. Awesome. So. I come from, 'cause my company does primarily exterior cleaning, so it's like we're very focused on recurring revenue. So in an epoxy world and epoxy floor, um, you like, you are kind of like a one and done.

Right. Other than those go backs. So you have to generate a lot larger client base and you're constantly chasing new leads. What is that? What, what does that look like? Man, this is something that I didn't really discover or wrap my head around until about six months in. Okay. Within veteran service brands, there are several other, um, several other companies and a lot of them are reoccurring service.

Um. And so I didn't realize, I guess I just didn't contemplate it or realize that a lot of service industry depends really on reoccurring business. Mm-hmm. And uh, we don't really offer that. I mean, we offer it, but it's just, it's not gonna be in the next year or two. 'cause we provide a service that you don't need us again for 10, 15 years, sometimes more depending on what they're using it for.

Um, so I'll tell you, we are generating customers like crazy and if we stop, the business stops. So that's why marketing and understanding it, um, is so important. That's why sales are so important. When you get a lead and you're able to go out and do an estimate, if you're not able to close that job, if you're not able to close 50, 60% of the customers that reach out to you, you're gonna be in, in a bad way very quickly.

Yes. So we try and do our very due diligence to make sure the customer understands who we are, what we are, why we're a trusted entity, and why they want to use us versus using most other companies. Not to say that there's not, I mean there are other companies in our area that are very reputable and, and awesome and I have shared work with other companies, but, uh, there are also those customers that, uh, are looking for that cheapest price tag and they're playing a dangerous game with, uh, people that are just not gonna be there to support 'em when they really need it.

Yeah. So 'cause um, part of that sales process and that customer life cycle, it's like once they've come through and now you've done the work, you've followed up, you've got the review, you're ma ensuring their satisfaction, um, you're. Invoicing, you're collecting payment. Um, and is there, do you have anything in place from that point where you do some type of standard follow up a year, three years, four years, anything like that?

I don't currently. Um, however, so we are trying to, um, kind of split the business where we are service based for residential customers, but we are also do a lot of commercial work under general contractors and the like. Okay. Um, and we have some national accounts as well that, uh, we're building and, and using currently, um, with some of those national accounts, you have a lot more opportunity for reoccurring business.

Mm-hmm. We do a couple of oil change shops. Um, a couple of the larger oil change shops that are gonna require, 'cause those floors get beat up. They're gonna require floor refreshes every three to five years, um, in order to maintain slip resistance and maintain keeping that oil out of the concrete and all of those other places.

So we are kind of imposing those processes in, in commercial opportunities. Yep. But it's really hard in the residential area and so fortunately because we just finished up the huge just a couple weeks ago. Mm-hmm. Um, one of the things that I'm looking to do is include, uh, ceiling four driveways. It's a big need here in Tennessee in general because of the freezes and because of the weather.

And it's something that we didn't offer previous, but it's something that we can get reoccurring business every couple of years out of a, out of a basic seal. So the huge has helped me kind of design that and it's something that I'm looking to implement here towards the end of the year. Now the ceiling of the driveway is great.

Um, 'cause with any coating now epoxy is quite durable, like you said last, I mean really has lifetime usage. But on the exterior surfaces like a driveway, anytime you put down a coating, you have to maintain that coating. Correct? Exactly right. So here's the introduction to your recurring services. So what is the difference between the material you put down on the epoxy floor interior as compared to what you're putting down on the exterior driveways?

Uh, well, it's obviously not as durable, but it does seal the concrete so you don't have to worry about staining. You don't have to worry about, um. The concrete dust and everything peeling up. But what it does do is it allows that concrete to last an awful lot longer. Mm-hmm. It does, um, avoids any spills, chemical resistant, all of that stuff.

But it will need in, in the next three to five years, you're gonna have to come back over it, scratch it, and reapply another sealer to it. It just breaks down anything that you put. I mean, even epoxy, if you put epoxy straight out in the sun, it's gonna break down a lot faster than something that's shaded or protected from the elements.

Yeah, of course. Yeah. Uv, sun, uh, the sun exposure, traffic, all of that sort of thing will break it down. Absolutely. Great. So I love that. So you're, you're identifying some recurring revenue opportunities. That's great. Um, so what has been the most difficult part in your first 18 months? Oh, um, I would say. I would say money management has been right, so we opened the business.

Um, I'm fortunate that, uh, I, I've retired from the military and kind of prop myself up. Financially my life is okay, but the business, there's all, with high ticket projects, there's a lot of risk. So when you're doing anywhere from three to $25,000 projects, um, especially when you're in the commercial realm where the payments are 30, 60, 90 day, um, payments, you don't have a, a lot of revenue coming in.

In spurts. So you have to be very aware and you need to be forecasting all of that money, making sure you're capable of making payroll, making sure you're capable of buying the materials for the next project and all of those things. And learning a system or devising a system that works for us mm-hmm.

Was something that I struggled with for the first couple of months, understanding how much money was gonna come in and when, versus how much money had to go out, both monthly overhead and project specific. Right. So we're talking cashflow, we're talking finance now. Um, do you have any experience in finance?

So, so what, what are you learning to do different? How are, how are you mitigating this? Well, I had absolutely no experience. Okay. Um, but what we as most of us don't, absolutely none. So it becomes a problem. And then we have to learn. I generally thought like, Hey, I'm good. I manage my own checkbook. I I pay my own bills.

Right? This is gonna be easy. No big deal. Oh, new level. Right. Oh man. Oh yeah. So there was some stressful times that, uh, we got tight, we did a lot of commercial work and I didn't forecast appropriately. And our, our business bank account got down into less than a thousand dollars over even just this winter.

Yeah. And it. And it's not because we weren't doing work or doing business, it's because I wasn't being strategic enough in the way that I did it. Mm-hmm. Um, so because of that, I've got a couple of working spreadsheets. There are, um, and actually I think the huge has a couple of, uh, things that they can provide that they provided to me.

But I've kind of developed my own between the franchises and a couple of different products that I've looked up. And so I've got a really good flow now that as long as I sit down and look at it once a week, I can make sure that I'm managing my bank account, managing the business appropriately from a financial perspective, um, as well as I'm working diligently and dig us out of a small SBA loan that, uh, is, holds us back, right.

We're spending that couple thousand dollars a month in, uh, overhead that. It shouldn't be there after we get it paid off, that'll, uh, free up hopefully a fair amount of money so that me personally can start making a decent amount of money with the business. Yeah, it, it's so true. I mean, the cash injections into when you're starting up, but even as you go along, when you hit those low points, it's very important to have access to lines of credit, um, to any type of cash investment that you can.

I mean, uh, myself and my own company, 26 years in business, I experienced a lot of this over the last year. And, um, so it, it doesn't really go away. And it is all about, you know, managing the cash, the cash flow, and, you know, I thinking about a budget, how do you, how are you predicting. And being predictive of your income, of your revenue.

When you're a young company of 18 months and all of your business is coming from new leads mm-hmm. What does that look like? Lots and lots of lessons learned. So we have gotten to the point now where we stay consistently booked anywhere from four to six weeks out, um, which is kind of the sweet spot for us.

Uh, we would like to be booked farther, but I've kind of discovered that people aren't willing to wait. Yep. Two months, three months to have a floor installed. So we try not to book too much farther out than that. Um, but in that we are forecasting those payments and forecasting that income, um, as well as.

Where we were using credit initially to kind of prop us up for material costs and whatnot. Mm-hmm. We are now kind of moving past that and we're starting to stockpile reserves in order to have an operational budget that doesn't require that credit injection on a regular basis. Not to say we won't get there 'cause we did in just the last couple of months.

But, uh, prior to that and, and thankfully we did, we had 20 or uh, 25,000, $30,000 in the account that just was able to float to us as necessary while we wait for payments. Um, but honestly I don't have the perfect answer yet. And only having a year to look back on, and that year was insane where I expected to do less than a hundred thousand dollars in business the first year and we did $350,000.

The first year it was a, a blessing and a curse. It was, it was trial by fire like I've never dealt with. But, uh, we're trying to take all of those lessons learned and all of those, uh, unnecessary expenses, or I don't wanna call 'em gambles, but you have to test things out. You gotta spend money on marketing that you're not sure is gonna work.

You've gotta buy equipment that you hope is the, the right answer, the right tool. Yep. Um, it's risk. Yeah. All of it. And then, and then of course, I've, I've dealt with Epoxy for fun prior to having this business, but I didn't have any real epoxy experience, so, yeah. Um, not that I broke floors, but I definitely spent more money in material that I didn't need to spend.

Mm-hmm. That, that ultimately cost me over the long run. And it's starting to pay off now 'cause my shop is finally starting to get dry of all the extra material I bought for fear of not having enough. Right. Yeah. Well, you know, it's all about, and we've all made these mistakes, you know, it's the same thing, different scenario, but it's really about what you do with the mistakes and how you learn and grow from them that counts.

And, um, so, you know, you're really off to a great start. Um, what, in your first 18 months, just kind of leaning into that, what would you do different? Um, I wouldn't have now with the experience, say I'm starting a new business today versus, uh, and, and taking all the knowledge and experience with me. Um. I certainly would've started a business, I probably would've gone to a different field.

Not that I don't love my business and don't love doing epoxy floors, 'cause I really do. But as a very first business owner, I wish I would've selected a business that had a little less risk. Mm-hmm. My project, right? I have to inject several thousand dollars into every project. So it's, it's a pretty high risk, it's high reward when it goes well, but it's hard to come up with that cash the first couple of months and make all of that stuff work.

So, um. I've talked with my wife about opening another business in the next couple of years. I'm sure I'll get stabbed for saying that out loud, but, uh, in the next couple of years, I would like to, but I, I, I'd like to probably adjust the field that we go into and be a little more cautious, um, and do a little more research on the, do a little more benefit analysis.

Um, 'cause I wasn't ready. I, I didn't, uh, I didn't quite understand and unfortunately I bought a franchise, which comes with a slew of support and guidance and I was gonna ask that. And I did get into the huge, which has been great, being around people that I want to elevate myself to that can help walk me through some of these pitfalls that I didn't see coming.

Yeah. Um, but yeah, if I had to do it again, I probably would've chosen a field that's, uh, a little less risk by the project. Mm-hmm. Um. And something that's, um, reoccurring, right? Reoccurring. So what are you envisioning? I would like to open a either pressure washing or a paint business here in the Nashville area.

Yeah. Paint. Paint in the southeast. Any type of exterior cleaning. Yes. Very, very needed. I mean, a, a 30 year paint from Sheron Williams is not 30 years. We know that. Of course not. Um, yeah. Excellent. And there's so much technology coming out, um, in all industry, which is phenomenal. I mean, we've got, you know, I was just watching a video last night on social media that, you know, we've got AI powered drones that you basically, they're, I mean, they are.

Painting. Mm-hmm. Experience of buildings. I mean, it's exciting, right? It, it really is exciting to see what, you know, where the future goes. Even in home services and commercial services, any type of, um, you know, maintenance industry. I think that there is so much opportunity there. Um, is what, what intrigues you about the painting?

Well, I, so within Veteran Service brands, we have a, a company called Paint Core. Um, they, I wanna say they have 30 or 40 locations throughout the us Okay. Um, all, all veteran owned again. Okay. Um, their business model is much different than Mock Ones is, so they do subcontract all of their painting work. Uh, of course the owners will go out and they'll help and they'll do some painting stuff, but they really use a subcontracting model.

Um, and they have a great method of selecting subcontractors. Um, so they maintain very, very high standards. And so essentially your, your risk is a lot less. 'cause you don't have to be the technical expert in the field, right. But if you have the sales capacity or capability and you have the tools, you can sell those paint jobs with ease.

Um, and fortunately when you, if you were to buy a franchise, you come with a mold to work in, you don't have to recreate the wheel. Um, and they're doing really well over there. And it's one of the things that Nashville is actually missing from veteran service brand's perspective. Yeah, the subcontract contracting model is very interesting.

Um, I've, I've kind of shifted my mindset on it because I used to say. You know, I know that I have a lot of competitors that 10 99, they're employees. Mm-hmm. And I don't believe that they're doing it lawfully. I believe that, you know, these 10 99 subcontracted, uh, W nine employees are probably not properly insured.

Um, they're probably, you know, they're sticking a magnet on their truck and now they're part of their company, they're going and doing the work, but they probably, even if it's just an owner operator that's just a single person, they probably don't have work comp or a ghost policy on themselves. Mm-hmm. So there's that.

Um, you know, do they have their own equipment? Are you providing it for them? So, I think there's a lot of things that are going wrong with subcontracting, but I also think that there's companies that are doing it right. Absolutely. We know that the, so there's a lot of risk in that first part, but, you know, we know that, you know, we.

Managing payroll, payroll expenses, payroll taxes, the full liabilities that come with payroll, um, the workers' comp, all of that creates a huge amount of cost to a company. Um, and I've always said like, oh, I'm gonna do everything by the book and I'm gonna make sure and da da da, and it's cost did. And so, but what I see now is very strong and modeled companies doing most of their work is subcontracted out.

They're doing it the right way and they're making a larger profit off of that because they don't have all of these other expenses within the company. Um, we know cost of labor and cost of goods is, you know, especially in any type of service, 'cause we're selling labor, right? Mm-hmm. And you have a lot of materials in what you do.

Um, and with painting, there's probably a lot of material involvement as well. But labor's expensive. Very. So yeah, I, I think you're onto something and it sounds like Pink Core has got it figured out pretty good too. Yeah, I think the proper vetting of sub co subcontractors and having a solid subcontractor agreement is essential.

Um, so yeah, it'd be really fun as you kind of explore that, bringing it back to the huge community and letting us know what that looks like, because I think that's opportunity for all of us. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. And it's something that I'm exploring, something we're working with. I mean, um, veteran service brands would love it, that they would love me to open every different brand that they have here.

I can only afford to do so much upfront, but Right. Yeah. It's something that I'm kind of excited about, but I wanna make sure that I've got Mach one really locked on and, and we're, we're really getting there, but something that I can set aside and allow it to basically run on its own for the most part.

Yeah. Before I move on to something else, um, but I'm glad you brought up insurance. Insurance is a, a big thing that, uh, is. As, as a new business owner that you think that you understand, you come in, you know, you've gotta get some workers' comp, you know, you've gotta get a general liability. There's a lot of, a lot of basics that, uh, people think that they understand.

Man, the insurance world blew me away. I had no idea, I had no idea when I started doing some commercial work that I was gonna be required to have an umbrella policy. I don't even know what umbrella policy was. Right. And then the different levels of requirements. I, I've, I've invested maybe a quarter of a million dollars to get my business up and running, um, to date.

Mm-hmm. And I'm covered for, I have to be covered for $5 million per event. Right, right. I'm just, I'm putting epoxy on a floor. I'm not lighting fires or it, it is wild. Um, and then one of the biggest lessons, and I, I literally learned it yesterday. I'm sure somebody told me, I'm not saying nobody informed me, but I got an email that said, Hey, you gotta do your insurance audit.

Mm-hmm. Insurance audit, honey. Fun. Welcome. So, like, so I called, um, our company and they were very, very nice and polite and explained to me, okay, Brandon, you have an insurance policy. You forecasted you were gonna do this type of business for this long and you were gonna make, generate this much revenue with these employees.

Okay. Yeah. I didn't do any of that. Absolutely not. I'm, I'm way beyond what I forecasted. Right. And they're like, okay, we're just letting you know that you're probably gonna have a supplemental insurance bill. Okay. What does, what does that look like? Well, we did three times as much as I forecasted, and we have two employees and I plan to have no employees, so I'm.

Impatiently waiting. Currently for my supplemental insurance bill, that should be here probably today or tomorrow is gonna be a couple thousand dollars that I'm not gonna like writing the check for. But it was one of those things that I just, I. I didn't know, didn't, didn't think about. Yeah. And, uh, I hope that somebody hears this and goes, you know what?

I should pay attention when they say audit 'cause it might come back around. Yep. Proper, you know, record keeping payroll is so crucial and the way that we report it, um, you know, with work comp you have different class codes that your employees fall in. So your technicians are a different class code than your administrative staff or sales and things like that.

And it's a different rate per $100 of payroll that you, that you pay them. Um, the higher risk comes in and when you have accidents and claims and things like that, your rate per 100 goes up. Yeah. And when you're safe and you don't have accidents or any claims, then your rate. Can stay or sometimes they're cool and they drop it.

Um, but yeah, these are all very tricky things and you know, for those that are listening that work at Height, um, I know that we have great equipment out there that allows us to work safely from the ground, but it is inevitable that we have to get on ladders or do any type of rooftop work or whatnot. And it's extremely important.

The one tip that I can share with any listeners, um, that's kind of been gold for us is we actually try to designate employees that do the work at height. And we, we have a way that we're showing that on the invoice side because, and then also on the payroll side, so that when we get audited, we're only paying that higher rate, that class code for those employees doing that work, the ones that are working from the ground, we're keeping those at that lower rate.

So talk to your insurance. Um. Uh, agent and make sure that they really give you the ins and outs about how you can use effective reporting to, you know, be prepared for when you get these audits. Um, because it can save you thousands and thousands of dollars. Yeah, I, and epoxy is still somewhat of a, a. Not a brand new, but it's definitely growing quickly.

So a lot of these insurance companies, we, and, and even in the contractor world, we don't fit into any of their classification codes very well. Mm-hmm. We don't fit in with painting, we don't fit in with general construction. So it's, it, it's been a pain to figure out exactly where we're gonna fit in appropriately and make sure that we're insured appropriately.

'cause the last thing I want is to have an accident, find out that I'm either underinsured or not. Right. Um, I wanna make sure that our guys are taken care of and, and more so our customers. I don't want anybody to have concern that they've got, that they're owning liability that they shouldn't. Mm-hmm. Um, so we are definitely over-insured in a lot of ways, but, uh.

Thankfully because of the commercial work we've done, it's been a requirement. And so I'm, I'm, I go to sleep at night not worrying about that. Yeah, sure. I'm a little worried about an extra tax bill or an extra insurance bill that's coming, but uh, right. As far as us being insured, I'm not. Well that's okay because you know, now you know you're building history, you know, you're starting out and, you know, it really takes the first three years of history to really.

Get you to a point where you can look back and then become predictive about how to budget and plan for your next year and what to, you know, have your, um, premiums set at and things like that. And your insurance company'll help you do that. But, you know, this is just all part of the growth phase and, you know, you're doing a lot of great things, Brandon, I gotta tell you.

Yeah, I, I'm very impressed. They, they were very quick to tell me, Hey, the first one's always the hard one. You'll be okay after that. Just get through the first one. You'll be all right. Yeah, you will. And they'll walk, they'll walk you through it. Okay. They'll walk you through it. Um, so, uh, what kind of systems are you running in your business?

Uh, systems, how well you say systems, and I think of flooring systems. So I can talk you through some, some technical flooring stuff, but I don't think that's what we wanna talk about. So, um, communication systems, how your, like what does your CRM look like? Um. Uh, how you know are, so Yeah. QuickBooks. So you're using QuickBooks online, so I guess internal software systems.

Mm-hmm. Okay. So we have a couple of different systems we use to manage the business. Um, primarily our CRM is House Call Pro and Okay. They are great. Um, because we're part of a franchise, we get kind of front of line access to support, which is great. Um, as well as we've been able to help, uh, initiate some changes on their platform to, to benefit the epoxy world.

'cause currently there's not a CRM that really recognizes a epoxy as a, uh, as a service. So you can, I think Housecall Pro was set up for heating and air conditioning, so you can see how it all kind of fits that world. Yep. Um, and so we've been able to make some adjustments there. I use that system. For 75% of the business.

It manages our leads, it manages some of our sales and allows me to pull reports on how I'm doing in that realm. It manages the projects, the estimates. Um, I have built out checklists in there so both of the employees can see the checklists and they can go through the process to make sure that I, I get the information I need from every project as well as they're meeting, they're telling me via checklist that they are meeting my standards of work.

They're doing all the things that I say are a must do on every project. Um, it, I'm gonna stop you on Housecall Pro. We just converted two Housecall Pro from ServiceTitan. It was, it has been painful, but, um, do you use what's called pipeline? Yes, HealthPRO. Perfect. Great. Yeah, we're just, we're just getting that launched and I'm excited to use that.

Um, but you wanna talk about pipeline a little bit 'cause Absolutely. We talk about the lead gen and following the lead and the 50 60 conversion and all of that. So we have pipeline, uh, locked in with our marketing company. So every time a lead is generated, it does go into pipeline and pipeline sees the lead, it populates it into a bucket, uh, a digital bucket.

And it notifies me that there's a lead there. Gives me the opportunity to go in and, and either call the customer, text the customer through house, call pro or through my phone and populates some notes. At that point in time, if you don't get a customer either on the phone or you're not able to secure an estimate or the customer.

It is just hard to get ahold of. You can move either into another bucket or you can set automations where it automatically moves to another bucket and Housecall Pro will automatically start reaching out to that customer based off of the parameters, the timing, and the types of communication that you want.

Um, we use a three step process. So after 72 hours, if we have not touched that lead, or if the lead has not communicated, um, with the system, it'll generate an email. And then after that, it'll send a text message. And then after that, it'll make a phone call and it'll do that over a two week period before it deems that lead lost or, or no longer functional.

Um. So we track those. And what's nice about it's that it does provide a report. You can pull out a report at any point in time and evaluate your system and, and whether your timing is working or not working, or if the communication that you've automated in there is the right communication and feeding and generating customer response, or if it's just falling on deaf ears.

Yep. Um. So it's really a, a huge help, especially from a guy that's doing all of the things. Sometimes I just can't get to the leads on a daily basis, and sure, I should be calling every lead and sometimes I just can't. And fortunately, housecall Pro at least gives us a chance and sends a text message right away, and then it'll follow up in 72 hours.

Um, I can tell you that it's probably, uh, I wonder if I can pull the report, but I, I think that it, in the last week, it's generated two jobs. Nice. Out, out of just thin air. Right. Awesome. Yeah. So yeah, this is the system, you know, systemizing the sales process and automating it. Mm-hmm. Um, so yeah, I'm, I'm glad you shared that a little bit with us and, um, yeah, house Call Pro has been great.

I know there's a lot of other CRMs out there. We're not trying to do a big plug for House Call Pro right now, but you and I do have that in common. Yeah. So that. There's a lot of CRMs out there, and, and I know that there's a lot of 'em that are great, and I'm not saying Housecall Pro is necessarily even better than any of the others.

Of course. The one thing that I've absolutely heard, without a doubt from multiple owners, it's the transition from one CRM to the other that is the bane of everybody's existence. So everybody's very fearful of going from one platform to the other. 'cause getting all their information transitioned is terrible.

How was yours? I can't even go there.

I mean, you know, I'm a 26 year company with, you know, over 7,000 clients and you're talking about so much data history. Oh. Um, from photographs to, you know, just account details and notes and Oh my gosh. Um, I will tell you one thing, and this is something that, uh, I could help maybe somebody prevent. So like with Housecall Pro, you have phone numbers.

That and you have multiple phone numbers that you can utilize for different marketing campaigns or whatnot. In ServiceTitan, you could generate a a phone number for every single marketing campaign that you did so that when they used that phone number and called in, you could track the ROI on that specific campaign.

Great. We had over a hundred phone numbers when we were using ServiceTitan and when we transitioned to House Call Pro. Only six of them ported over. Oh no. So we have thousands of customers with phone numbers. Now can they go online and just Google search us and find our current phone number? Of course they can.

But the age demographic of these clients, really, they probably have it like written on a business card on their refrigerator or in their phone as a contact, and they're calling and unresponsive. And, um, this has been extremely challenging. And so anyway, like there's so many things that you couldn't even dream this stuff up that it's gonna happen to you, right?

Um, but not to go through a whole problem solving process, but could you, um, with the information and knowing what customers were reached, could you set up a campaign to reach out to all those customers and offer 'em, like, Hey, we've changed our phone number, but we wanna make sure you have a good current number and here's a 10% coupon for your next service.

Yeah, we're marketing it hard. You know, all of these same clients, of course, we're email marketing to and doing text campaigns and things like that, so we're reaching them slowly but surely, uh, the timeliness of it being the brink of spring and that's when the most phone activity happens, um, is not good.

Um, but the problem is, is that these phone numbers were kept alive. Meaning when customers were calling these phone numbers, it didn't go right. Yeah. It was Sheila Selta's voice saying, Hey, this is a plus pro, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they were leaving us a message and, um, we have had not, not had success recovering those messages from ServiceTitan.

Oh. Um, and, you know, not trying to spread bad news about ServiceTitan, I'm just saying that, you know, the, to me that they're sitting somewhere on a server and I would, I would do anything to have them. Um, but we're having to pivot. I'm still trying to work with them. This is all very new, but yeah, it's, it's been, it's been very tricky, but there's, yes, you're right.

Going back to switching software platforms, um, I try to think about, you know, choose one that is gonna take, like, if you can envision the, the. The most capacity of your company and what the needs are gonna be with A CRM and get one that is gonna serve all the way through, like what you envision the largest, you know, size of your company would be.

Um, because you're right. You don't wanna change. Yeah. You don't wanna change. And sometimes we have to. Um, but you know, it's, it, it is, it is very difficult. Thank God I have a really good team that we've all, I mean, this has been all hands on deck for like four months doing this. It's been crazy. I believe it.

I believe it. Well, I hope you're happy with Housecall Pro. I hope it We are. Yeah, we are. It's all of the needs. I mean, I, I inherited 'em. I don't know any other CRM. Um, they came with the franchise and, but at the same time, they've been extremely helpful and extremely moldable to our business. Yep, they are.

Um, I've been really spoiled with reporting on ServiceTitan, and I am starting to learn how to utilize reporting much better in Housecall Pro. I'm, I love to geek out on reports and, um, they really tell you everything that you need to know and where you need to focus. Um, so data is king and so yeah, I'd say all, all in all, it's been a very good experience.

Um, so Brandon, you're, you just joined the huge mastermind. Last year. Correct? That's correct. Great. And how did you hear about the huge, you know, how, what, what brought you into the huge just come to convention the first time? Another perk of being a franchisee. Um, I, our C-O-O-J-S Barry reached out to me and said, Hey man, um, there is a huge convention.

And of course he said, huge convention. I'm like, okay, there's huge conventions all the time. No, no, no. The huge convention Uhhuh was in Nashville. I'm like, okay. So I did a little research and they're like, and he called me back and said, Hey, I got you a ticket. You need to go. I'm like, well, my was that optional?

He said, no, no, no, no. You don't have to go, but you need to go to this site. And so we went. Um, he actually joined me and we got to meet a slew of other service-based home o um, home business operators. Yep. And it was great conversation, just being in the area and seeing what was available. Um. And then we got sold.

He and I both got sold on joining the huge and he's like, man, this, this seems great. I know you're really new. Will you do this? And he actually offered to, um, cover the first three months of the huge, he's like, Hey, if, if it's not gonna work, it's not gonna work. And I will, we'll find a way to break it off and, and we'll cover the cost.

But go to the first three months. I can tell you when I showed up to the huge, I brought my wife as a guest for the first one. And uh, after we were done, we were driving home and both of us were like, I. I like to pride myself on being able to stand shoulder to shoulder with most people and at least understand what's going on.

Man, I was in a room with people that were so far beyond me in some, in all the good ways, right? You wanna surround yourself by the people that are, are where you want to be. Sure. And I was in that room and I was awestruck by both franchise or entrepreneur owners that were doing great things and they were sharing information and they were going through, they were, I was able to talk where I was at and they're like, oh yeah, you just need to create a couple of SOPs and generate, and they were taking such, what I considered hard problems and providing such simple solutions.

And I was just in awe of like, how come I couldn't think of that? And being in that community now, um, over the last six months has been fantastic. I love that. So when you say, um, first of all, I love that you used the word simple because simplifying. The first of the five leadership abilities. And the more that we can simplify and you starting out in your first 18 months, the more you can keep things simple, the more you'll be able to gain that hands-off business.

I'm learning this after all my years. I, I've, I, consequently I've built a pretty complicated entity and now I'm scaling back. I'm trying to simplify. And so, you know, when you're getting started, I would say yes. Thank you for saying that because, um, keeping it simple, keeping it simple, stupid they say, but keeping it simple is really gonna help you, uh, create that entrepreneurial life that you dream of.

Yep. Absolutely. Um, so when you say you joined the huge, uh, you mean that you joined the huge mastermind? Yes, yes. Okay, awesome. And so, um, yeah, I, I love it. What, just gimme one nugget. Like what is one thing? 'cause you were at this recent one in Nashville that was just this past month. I actually missed the one this last Oh, you did?

Okay. I, I watched recordings and, and, and did the homework and everything, but I was, um, I was out of town in California at the time, but, um, yeah, the dokey recordings were great, weren't they? Absolutely. Yeah. The, I can tell you hands down, the biggest takeaway that I've had since I've been there is understanding your market, um, going through the process and evaluating what is out there versus what you're doing.

Yep. Um, completely changed my mindset. I was looking at the market from a perspective of I get a small slice. Because I'm the new guy, I get a small slice of this market that is, it's got 25, 30 other concrete coating companies in it. Um, and I've got hard competition to, to grow. Mm-hmm. Until we sat down, I, I believe it was our first, uh, our first get together.

We sat down and went through and evaluated the market in, in our area and, uh, Sid gave us the, the algorithm and said, Hey look, this is what you need to do and you need to focus on being the biggest fish in the smallest spawn. So find the area that you wanna work and you wanna focus on and, and do the math.

Figure out what that market looks like. I was blown away. Uh, there, there is a billion dollar industry, um, overall in Nashville between commercial and residential. And it's gonna continue to grow in the next 10 years because of the influx of people coming to the Tennessee area. And it. There's no way all of the concrete coating companies that are out there, and I can keep up with it.

So there is a market that we can get to. And I was fearful that I was gonna run out of work or I wasn't gonna be able to generate enough work. And now it's, I was able to turn that completely around on myself and look at it from the perspective of, I'm the one that's holding us back. I need to do marketing, more marketing, I need to do more sales.

It's not that there's not work out there, I just gotta go find it. Right. Yeah. And, um, this is, this is really big and I would, I I, I agree with you that, uh, being part of the mastermind, um, understanding my market, how to be the big fish in the small pond, um, and doing that market analysis and the way that, the way that I've applied it in my company and that, you know, the Mastermind has taught us is, you know, so like for example, my current market, I know that my.

My customer avatar is residential homes. Yes, we do commercial as well, but let's just stay on residential. Residential homes valued 600,000 and above. Great. Now I gotta figure out how many of those are in my market. Okay? Now there's this huge number of houses, 600,000 and above. Now, what's a realistic market share percentage that I think that we can, that we can get, right?

So let's say 10%, 12%, 20%, whatever. Whatever you think. So now you have this number. Great. What is your average ticket? That tells you how much revenue you can generate in that current market. And you know, then they go on to teach you like, okay, now how do you, how do you get that market? Yeah, yeah. Now you know, it's there.

Whatcha gonna do about it? Yeah. Stay tuned. Um, but so yeah, it's gold, right? It's gold. Absolutely. I, it was mind blowing. And that was our, our very first, uh, our very first mastermind that I attended and there was a couple other, um, new guys in there as well. And all of us were, we just, we never looked at it from that perspective.

We'd always looked at it from what we can do right now and not from what's out there and available. And it, it's a game changer for sure. Yeah. And it is very simple. And the same principles apply for a new Chick-fil-A that's coming into a market then, you know. A plus pro that's trying to grow in a current, you know, little coastal market, right?

Like it, the same, same business principles apply and it is a very, um, simple framework that we're, you know, uh, that we're learning while in the huge community. So yeah, thanks for sharing with that and um, I'm excited to meet you virtually, but now I get to meet you in person, Brandon, and it's been lovely to get to know you.

Yeah, thank you for taking the time. This was a lot of fun. Yeah, I, I am, I love your story and I think a lot of things I really appreciate, appreciate you being honest and, you know, sharing your struggles with our, with our listeners. Um, I think that's really important and I know that there's people that are listening that are gonna say, oh, yeah, okay.

Uh, that's very helpful. Um, they're gonna help them avoid making the same mistakes or just knowing like, okay, I need to, I need to be paying attention to these things. So if we can help avoid any of those problems with this huge transformations podcast, that is what we are looking to do. We wanna help entrepreneurs and their entrepreneurial journey and, uh, thank you Brandon for sharing your story with us today.

I love it. Thank you. Hello my friend. This is Sid. Thank you again so much for taking your time to listen to today's episode. I hope you got some value from it. And listen, anything that was covered, uh, any of the resources, any of the books, any of the tools, anything like that is in the show notes. So it's easy for you to find and check it out.

And also, I wanna let you know. Mission for the huge convention and for this podcast is to help our blue collar business owners like you and I, to gain financial and time freedom through running a better business. And we do that in four ways. Number one is our free weekly newsletter. It's called a Huge Insider.

I hope you subscribe. It is the most valuable newsletter for the home service industry, period, paid or otherwise. And this one's free. Next is the huge foundation's education platform that has, we've got over 120 hours of industry specific education and resources for you. And every month we do, uh, a topical webinar and we do question and answer with seven and eight figure business owners.

And it's available to you for a $1 trial for seven days. Next, of course, is the huge convention or the huge convention. If you haven't been, you gotta check it out. It's. Every August this year it's in Nashville, Tennessee. That's August 20th through 22nd and 2025. And it is the largest and number one rated trade show and convention for home service business builders.

We've got the biggest trade show, so you can check out all the coolest tools and meet the vendors and check out the software to run your business. And it's got, we've got, um, education, world class education and educators and speakers that will teach you how to run a better business. And it's the best networking opportunity that you can have within the home service business.

And then lastly, if you wanna pour jet fuel in your business, check out the used Mastermind. Now, it's not for everyone. You gotta be at over $750,000 of revenue and you're building toward. A million, 5 million, 10 million in the next five years. And it is a network and a mentorship and a mastermind of your peers.

And we help you understand and implement the Freedom Operating System. We go into more detail, but you can get all the information on all four of these programs and how we'll help you advance your business quickly just by going to the huge convention.com. And scroll down, click on the freedom path. Or of course you can find the links here in the show notes.

So, sorry, I feel like I'm getting a little bit wordy, but I just wanna let you know of the resources that are available to you to help you accelerate and advance your beautiful, small business. So keep on growing, keep on learning, keep advancing. And if you'd like to show, go ahead. I mean, if you would go and take 90 seconds and give us a review on iTunes, then subscribe and share it, man.

It would really mean the world to us. It would help other people. It as we continue our mission to help people just like you and me. So thanks again for listening. We'll see you in the next episode.